What about adding a calm attribute to Dispell?

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Waynek the Strongest
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Re: What about adding a calm attribute to Dispell?

Post by Waynek the Strongest » Thu Nov 27, 2014 8:09 pm

Yeah I did not do the maths, these would be quite fastidious for a simple game.
But if you went through them and got the right figures, well, it still show that this is quite a good strategy, one that will not insure win but still insure a decent winrate.
Basically, after some simple additions, i figured out that a 400 health (I would include heal and HP in this number) would insure you to survive with a decent amount of HP (like 100) to such a deck, and a little more if it happens that you have mystify to block a good part of the damage (blocking their might+ some more damage). Which means that, without sacrificing too much might you could achieve such a health (considering the 50HP heal of Blood Festival for orc, and the HP from Special card for Human knight)
And surviving this burst of damage would give you a free win afterwards (The enemy would barely deal any damage, as you can damage them for as much as you want (they won't have a backup plan nor any defensive card once they used everything).

That means, best way to fight these decks would be to take a little more HP (currently have 320 on my orc), as all their damage is burst, and their burst is not sufficient.

That's fine for me, except for the one fact that you won't be able to do anything to a Keeper (your burst being limited by lower might, and their regeneration healing them as much as you can damage them, not taking in account any additionnal defensive card)

Aleatory
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Re: What about adding a calm attribute to Dispell?

Post by Aleatory » Thu Nov 27, 2014 9:06 pm

Yeah, Melee Class benefits from High HP and Might - the balance between the two is definitely the question at higher levels.
(edit: I think 320 for your Orc is a good amount - definitely the 'Mythical' [Blood Festival] would give you apprx. another 150 HP, especially against an Orc deck as you were describing: one that does not include any reduce heal cards. The two 'Mythical' play cards are almost always a must for every deck; the buff card and [Haunting Voices] should only be included for specific purposes)

I also agree that Melee suffers from playing Keepers with high Regen, as there aren't many cards or combos that "reduces heal HP" for Human Knight or Orc Warrior - the only ones that deal a significant amount of reduce heal HP are just the 'Mythical' buff card and it's corresponding combo for each Character (maybe you could try a deck to include these cards and only use it to fight Keepers?). Perhaps in a future update they will get another card/combo to do this.
~Aleatory

Waynek the Strongest
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Re: What about adding a calm attribute to Dispell?

Post by Waynek the Strongest » Thu Nov 27, 2014 10:35 pm

Haunting Voice is not of any use due to the skill that allows you to draw more cards (currently four, I m upgrading to 5, so haunting voice is useless).

The only way I found to fight Keeper so far is a deck built around two combos:
Burning blow (Combo with the Mythic buff) that basically negates enemy heal
And Orcish war, which is an awful lot of damage combined with some heal reduction (something like 20)

Still haven't really tried it to a real strong Keeper.
Keeper players are usually spamming arena due to their OP regeneration in this mode

Motylek
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Re: What about adding a calm attribute to Dispell?

Post by Motylek » Fri Nov 28, 2014 10:15 am

Aleatory and Waynek the Strongest,

Orcs definitely has tools to fight with Elf Keepers. If you will ever see ranking TOP1 player (he is Orc Warrior) on Europe server playing duel against Elf Keeper, you would know. I will not tell what his deck is like, but Orcs definitelly can fight successfully with Keepers without need of any new cards update.

But this is alittle offtopic. Lets keep discussion on theme.

Best regards
Motylek

kaiser
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Re: What about adding a calm attribute to Dispell?

Post by kaiser » Sun Dec 14, 2014 4:08 am

When this combo was release just a few people realize the important of this combos, and as Motylek already mention, for meele class the offensive is basic defense, so there is different options to avoid the debuff, if you are meele class just do a combo after turn 3 with the heroic cards and the card that is for regular debuff, but do it when the enemy use the dispel combo. After that you could go ahead with the same strategy if you wish 8-)

This is my best combo, if I play this as an orc is not for the damage, I just do it for the dispel itself and the armory debuff. I don't really care about the damage.

Waynek the Strongest
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Re: What about adding a calm attribute to Dispell?

Post by Waynek the Strongest » Wed Dec 17, 2014 4:37 am

I know it is not damage oriented and I wasn't complaining about the utility aspect of the combo.
I was just saying that the melee combo allows you not to waste any time. You can both deal decent damage (and thus proc your might) and have this huge utility debuff.
Such a debuff should imply something more if you wanna deal damage at the same time (like archers and rogue who has some bonus damage as well but have to have another active damage dealing card)

kaiser
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Re: What about adding a calm attribute to Dispell?

Post by kaiser » Wed Dec 17, 2014 4:52 am

Of course will be good to add additional damage, but the additional attribute right now is remove 3 spaces from the hand, that became useless since the skill of tactics started to be effective. But taking about that you give me a good idea xD

Ty :mrgreen:

Waynek the Strongest
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Re: What about adding a calm attribute to Dispell?

Post by Waynek the Strongest » Wed Dec 17, 2014 5:03 am

You got it wrong I think.
All three dispel combo have in common what follows:
Dispel effect
-5 buff slots
-3 hand slots(Mostly negated by tactics)
And what I would call an additionnal effect:
Bonus damage and EP debuff for ranged
Huge defense for Keepers
Flat damage and defense debuff for melees

The first one needs flat damage to be fully used
The second needs enemy to deal damage this turn to be fully useful (and it is quite OP if you consider the amount of damage mitigated combined with regeneration, this combo is somewhat like "I ll ruin you 10 cards, then I will fullheal by the time you get back some cards to deal damage)
But the third one is fully useful on its own.

kaiser
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Re: What about adding a calm attribute to Dispell?

Post by kaiser » Wed Dec 17, 2014 5:32 am

You are right sorry my mistake, for melee the bonus are
Damage base 13 (is for the charge card)
Reduce def 24 (12 are base for the charge card)
Bonus damage 13

The additional for melee is the def reduction.

About the ranger 100Ep it is a lot but not exaggerated

About the caster I think is balance because it do nothing as secondary bonus, and for an orc 2 shattering card that 80 def becomes 10 8-) plus your reduce def skill I drop all that Def to 4

Waynek the Strongest
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Re: What about adding a calm attribute to Dispell?

Post by Waynek the Strongest » Wed Dec 17, 2014 6:29 am

What I meant is that Melee combo involves flat damage (from charge card) that procs your might, while other combos need something else than just the cards you use to make them.

And you spoke about keeper whose defense would be destroyed by two shattering strikes.
Do you really feel like it s normal that you have to use two of the most offensive mythical, precisely made to neglect enemy defense to counter enemy defense?
To me, 60 defense would be more reasonable, still high enough to mitigate a lot of damage, yet much more counterable

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